>>> THIS IS "METROFOCUS," WITH RAFAEL PI ROMAN, JACK FORD AND JENNA FLANAGAN.

>>> "METROFOCUS" IS MADE POSSIBLE BY -- SUE AND EDGAR WACHENHEIM III, SYLVIA A.

AND SIMON B. POYTA PROGRAMING ENDOWMENT TO FIGHT ANTI-SEMITISM, THE PETER G. PETERSON AND JOAN GANZ COONEY FUND, BERNARD AND DENISE SCHWARTZ, BARBARA HOPE ZUCKERBERG, THE AMBROSE MONELL FOUNDATION.

AND BY -- JANET PRINDLE SEIDLER, JODY AND JOHN ARNHOLD, CHERYL AND PHILIP MILSTEIN FAMILY, JUDY AND JOSH WESTON, DR. ROBERT C. AND TINA SOHN FOUNDATION.

>>> GOOD EVENING AND WELCOME TO "METROFOCUS," I AM JACK FORD.

THE WORLD IS ON EDGE AS IT FACES THE EMERGENCE OF OMICRON, A HIGHLY MUTATED VARIANT OF THE CORONAVIRUS THAT HAS ALREADY BEEN DETECTED IN AT LEAST 20 COUNTRIES.

HEALTH OFFICIALS WARN THAT IT'S ONLY A MATTER OF TIME BEFORE OMICRON IS DETECTED HERE IN THE UNITED STATES.

MANY COUNTRIES INCLUDING THE U.S. ARE TOUGHENING RESTRICTIONS ON INTERNATIONAL TRAVELERS TO TRY TO SLOW DOWN THE SPREAD OF THE VARIANT.

IN NEW YORK CITY, ALL RESIDENTS ARE BEING ADVISED TO WEAR MASKS INDOORS AND IN PUBLIC.

PRESIDENT JOE BIDEN IS CALLING FOR CALM, SAYING THE VARIANT IS A CAUSE FOR CONCERN BUT NOT FOR PANIC.

WITH THE EMERGENCE OF OMICRON, IT'S RATTLED WORLD MARKETS AHEAD OF THE HOLIDAYS.

SO, SO MANY QUESTIONS EMERGE.

WHAT DO WE KNOW SO FAR ABOUT THIS VARIANT?

HOW CAN WE PROTECT OURSELVES?

ONE OF THE LATEST DEVELOPMENTS ON THE DRUGS BEING USED COVID, WELL, WE'RE PLEASED TO HAVE JOINING US TO HELP ANSWER SOME OF THOUGH QUESTIONS, FORMER NBC NEWS CHIEF MEDICAL CORRESPONDENT, AUTHOR AND ALSO PHYSICIAN WHO HAS REPORTED ON AND EXAMINED SO MANY OF THESE INFECTIOUS DISEASE ISSUES AND PANDEMIC ISSUES OVER THE LAST FEW DECK TODAYS, OUR GOOD FRIEND, DR. BOB ARNOT.

GOOD TO HAVE YOU.

>> THANK YOU, JACK.

>> LET'S START WITH SOME BIGGER PICTURE QUESTIONS, IF I CAN.

AND THEN WE'LL FOCUS ON SOME OF THE SPECIFICS OF THIS VARIANT AND WHAT IT MEANS AND WHAT WE SHOULD BE DOING ABOUT IT.

SO, BIGGER PICTURE QUESTION IS, WHAT ARE THESE -- WHAT ARE VARIANTS?

HOW DO THEY COME INTO BEING?

>> SO, SCIENTISTS CALL THIS KIND OF VIRUS THE KING OF -- IMAGINE A KID TRYING TO COPY SOMETHING OFF A BLACKBOARD AND MISSPELLING WORD AFTER WORD.

IT'S NOT THAT SMART.

IF YOU HAVE A DUAL-STRANDED DNA VIRUS, THEN IT CAN KIND OF CHECK SPELLING, IT'S LIKE A SPELL-CHECK, OH, I GOT THAT RIGHT.

BUT THE RNA, IT'S ALMOST LIKE IT'S DUMB.

IT JUST MAKES ALL OF THESE MUTATIONS WILLY NILLY AS THE KING OF ERRORS.

AND MOST OF THEM ARE NONSENSE, YOU KNOW, SOME PLACES IT DOESN'T COUNT, IT DOESN'T DO ANYTHING.

HOWEVER, IF YOU HAVE THESE MUTATIONS IN LARGE, UNVACCINATED POPULATIONS, IT CAN -- IT'S ALMOST LIKE A SAFE CRACKER.

IT'S TRYING AND TRYING AND TRYING TO SEE IF IT CAN GET A MUTATION THAT WILL DO SOMETHING DIFFERENTLY.

BE MORE VIRULENT, EVADE A VACCINE, FOR EXAMPLE.

SO, IT'S NOT INTELLIGENT AS A VIRUS, IT'S ACTUALLY DUMB, BUT IT SUCCEEDS THROUGH PURE DUMB LUCK.

>> I THINK THAT'S FASCINATING, BECAUSE WE TEND TO THINK OF THIS AS THIS EXTRAORDINARILY SINISTER AND AS A CONSEQUENCE SOPHISTICATED DIVIDE THAT'S EVADING EVERYTHING WE THROW UP AT IT, BUT THAT'S KIND OF NOT THE CASE.

IT JUST SORT OF HAPPENS OUT THERE?

>> IT DOES.

WE DO IT, YOU KNOW, THIS SORT OF AURA OF SITTING THERE AND FIGURING OUT, HOW DO I DO THIS AND THAT -- YOU KNOW, IT JUST ISN'T TRUE.

IT MAKES THESE ERRORS, WATCH THEM JUST GO BY THE WAYSIDE.

IT'S TRUE OF VIRUSES IN GENERAL.

BUT WITH THE SPIKE PROTEIN AS AN EXAMPLE, JUST TO BE CLEAR, WE HAVE THIS ACE-2 RECEPTOR AND SPIKE PROTEIN GOES INTO THAT AND THAT'S WHAT LOCKS INTO OUR BODY.

SO, THIS SPIKE PROTEIN COULD HAVE ONE OR TWO MUTATIONS, TEN MU MUTATIONS.

WE HAVEN'T SEEN A TON SO FAR.

HERE, HOWEVER, WE HAVE MORE MUTATIONS THAN WE HAVE EVER SEEN IN THIS SPIKE PROTEIN.

AGAIN, TO BE CLEAR, IF YOU THINK OF THE SPACE SHUTTLE, WHEN IT DOCKS, THAT DOCKING THERE, NOW YOU HAVE 32 MUTATIONS IN THE SPIKE PROTEIN, WHICH GIVES IT A MUCH GREATER OPPORTUNITY TO EITHER BE ABLE TO EVADE THE ANTIBODIES WE ALREADY HAVE IN OUR SYSTEM FROM VACCINATIONS OR A NEW VACCINATION.

>> AND HOW DOES THIS -- I MEAN OMICRON, HOW IS THIS DIFFERING FROM THE DELTA VARIANT THAT WE'VE BEEN DEALING WITH FOR SO LONG?

>> SO, THE DELTA VARIANT HAD FEWER MUTATIONS IN THE SPIKE.

SO, THIS HAS MORE.

IT MAY BE THAT THE VACCINES ARE LESS EFFECTIVE, THOUGH NOT INEFFECTIVE.

AND IT MAY ALSO BE THAT IT CHANGES ITS INFEKIVETY.

LET ME MAKE THAT POINT SUPER CLEAR.

IF THIS IS THE RECEPTOR HERE AND THIS IS THE ORIGINAL VIRUS, IT WAS KIND OF BLUNT, YOU KNOW?

IT WASN'T TERRIBLY INFECTIOUS, BECAUSE IT MIGHT JUST BOUNCE OFF.

BUT WITH DELTA, NOW YOU HAD THESE THREE HOOKS THAT NOW COULD HOOK ONTO YOUR BODY, MAKING IT MORE INFECTIOUS.

AND AGAIN, IT'S JUST TRYING AND TRYING AND TRYING TO FIND SOMETHING DIFFERENT.

SO, WE KNOW ABOUT DIFFERENCES IN DELTA IS THAT IN THIS PARTICULAR PROVINCE OF SOUTH AFRICA, YOUNG POPULATION THERE, THEY WERE DOWN TO 300 OR SO CASES OF DELTA AND IT JUMPED TO 2,200 YESTERDAY AND PROBABLY 10,000 BY THE END OF THE WEEK.

SO, IT APPEARS TO BE A HIGHLY, HIGHLY INFECTIOUS VIRUS.

TO BE CLEAR, THIS, THOUGH, IS A CONTEST, NOW.

IT'S A CONTEST BETWEEN OMICRON AND DELTA.

WHICH IS MORE INFECTIOUS AND WHICH IS GOING TO WIN?

AND WE JUST DON'T KNOW.

>> I'M GOING TO GET IN A MOMENT TO SOME OF THE SPECIFICS YOU MENTIONED HERE, BUT IT -- FOLLOWING UP ON YOUR THOUGHT THAT YOU JUST TALKED ABOUT A MOMENT AGO, AND THAT IS THE AREA OF THE VICINITY WHERE THIS APPARENTLY HAS BEEN DEVELOPING, WHAT DOES THAT TELL US ABOUT THE NEED FOR EXTENSIVE VACCINATION?

AND THE IMPACT THAT EXTENSIVE VACCINATION COULD HAVE MOVING FORWARD ON THE DEVELOPMENTS OF THESE VARIANTS?

>> SO, JACK, YOU KNOW, WE REALLY THINK OF THESE POORLY VACCINATED COMMUNITIES AND PLACES LIKE SOUTH AFRICA, THAT ALSO ARE PLAGUED BY HIV/AIDS, WHERE PEOPLE ARE IMMUNE COMPROMISED, IT'S A CALDRON, IT'S A BOILING POT FOR THE DEVELOPMENT OF THE VIRUS.

SO, WE TALK ABOUT AFRICA BEING THE FRONT LINE OF THE DEFENSE OF REMEMBER, THE EBOLA VIRUS IS AN EXAMPLE, THEY CALLED IT JUST AN AIRPLANE RIDE AWAY.

SO, YOU HAVE INCREDIBLY POOR VACCINATION RATES IN PLACES LIKE NAMIBIA OR ZIMBABWE.

SOUTH AFRICA, YOU KNOW, REALLY GETS THE BLAME WRONGLY, BECAUSE THEY HAVE FABULOUS VIROLOGY.

IT'S BECAUSE THEY WERE SO ON THEIR GAME THAT THEY ACTUALLY DETERMINED THIS.

BUT TO YOUR POINT, YOU KNOW, BY DEVELOPING THAT ASTRO SENN KA VACCINE AND HAVING IT PRODUCED IN SOUTH AFRICA AND SHIPPED TO EUROPE, IT WOULD HAVE BEEN BETTER OFF IF WE USED IT IN SOUTH AFRICA, BECAUSE THAT'S THE PROTECTION IN THE POOR COMMUNITIES LIKE THIS.

SOUTH AFRICA IS PLAGUED BY VERY POOR RURAL HEALTH BY THE SAME MISINFORMATION THAT WE HAVE, IN TERMS OF PEOPLE NOT WANTING TO GET THE VACCINE, SO, IT'S A TERRIBLE CONUNDRUM IN THAT WE SHOULD BE VACCINATING ALL OF SOUTH AFRICA, BOTSWANA, ZIMBABWE, SOUTH AFRICA ITSELF, BECAUSE WE JUST HAVEN'T, BECAUSE OF THIS, WHICH ISN'T JUST HERE IN THE INFORMATION, IT'S THROUGHOUT EUROPE.

YOU KNOW, IN EUROPE, THEY TALK ABOUT RED STATES AND EVEN SORT OF CRIMSON STATES THAT ARE SO RED AND IT'S SOUTH AFRICA, TOO.

THE AMERICAN MISINFORMATION HAVE BEEN THERE, AS WELL.

>> THEY ARE INTERESTING AND COMPELLING AND DISTURBING TERMS, BUT THEY ARE RELEVANT TO WHAT WE'RE LOOKING AT.

AND BEGIN, AS YOU SAID, THE SCIENCE WILL TELL YOU THAT THE MORE EXPANSIVE YOUR VACCINATION RATES ARE, THE LESS POSSIBILITY OF THESE VARIANTS BEING DEVELOPED.

LET ME COME BACK TO A COUPLE OF THE THINGS THAT WE TALKED ABOUT HERE AND THESE ARE QUESTIONS THAT ARE BEING ASKED ABOUT THIS.

AND THE FIRST IS, THE QUESTION OF TRANSMISABILITY.

WHAT ARE WE SEEING SO FAR ABOUT THE OMICRON VARIANT IN TERMS OF ITSES TRANSMISSIBILITY?

>> THE ISRAELIS BELIEVE IT'S MORE TRANSMISSIBLE.

SOUTH AFRICA, YOU LOOK AT THOSE NUMBERS, IN OTHER WORDS, YOU HAD ROUGHLY 300 CASES OR SO OF THE DELTA VARIANT AND THEN YOU SEE THIS JUMP TO 2,000 CASES AND THEN BY THE END OF THE WEEK, PROBABLY 10,000 CASES.

THAT'S SCALED THERE.

AND SO, YOU HAVE TO SAY, IT LOOKS MUCH MORE TRANSMISSIBLE, BECAUSE IT REALLY IS CATCHING ON FIRE.

THE QUESTION IS, WOULD IT HAPPEN IN A HIGHLY VACCINATED POPULATION, NORTHEASTERN UNITED STATES IS AN EXAMPLE?

WE JUST DON'T KNOW.

WE HAVE TO SEE, AS YOU HAVE THIS, YOU KNOW, WORLDWIDE COMPETITION BETWEEN DELTA AND OMICRON, WHETHER OMICRON, IN FACT, WILL WIN OR NOT.

>> THE NEXT QUESTION PEOPLE ASKING ABOUT IT IS, HOW VIRULENT THIS CAN BE.

AND I GUESS MY FIRST QUESTION BEFORE YOU ANSWER THAT IS, DOES IT NECESSARILY MEAN THAT IF SOMETHING IS MORE TRANSMISSIBLE IT'S AUTOMATICALLY GOING TO BE MORE VIRULENT?

>> JACK, IT'S SUCH A GREAT POINT YOU MAKE, BECAUSE NO.

IN SOUTH AFRICA NOW, THEY'VE SEEN THAT IT'S MUCH MORE TRANSMISSIBLE, HIGHLY TRANSMISSIBLE, BUT SO FAR, IN THESE YOUNG POPULATIONS, IT'S BEEN A VERY MILD BUT UNUSUAL VILE RUS.

NOW, THERE ARE PATIENTS WHO ARE IN ICU WITH THIS AND THEY'RE 90% UNVACCINATED, SO, WE ARE SEEING SOME VIR LENS, BUT SO FAR, DOCTORS ANECK DOTELY ARE SAYING IT DOESN'T LOOK LIKE IT'S ALL THAT VIRULENT.

BUT AGAIN, TIME WILL TELL, WE JUST DON'T KNOW AS IT GETS INTO OTHER POPULATIONS.

BUT YOUR GREAT POINT THERE, THE TWO ARE SEPARATE.

JUST BECAUSE IT'S MORE TRANSMISSIBLE DOESN'T MEAN IT'S MORE VIRULENT, VICE VERSA.

>> AND YOU MENTIONED WHAT WE'RE HEARING FROM SOUTH AFRICA, I THINK WE'RE HEARING ANECDOTALLY, I SAW THE HEALTH MINISTER IN ISRAEL, PRETTY MUCH THE SAME THING, WE'RE NOT SEEING SIGNIFICANT IMPACT, OR EFFECTS, IF YOU WOULD, OF THIS.

ABOUT HOW LONG WOULD IT TAKE BEFORE YOU THINK WE WILL HAVE SOME MORE SOLID SCIENTIFIC EVIDENCE THAT CAN PROVIDE US WITH AN ANSWER TO THAT QUESTION?

>> SO, JACK, THE SCIENTIFIC EVIDENCE IS TWO TO FOUR WEEKS AWAY, PROBABLY MORE LIKE FOUR WEEKS, TO REALLY VIGOROUSLY LOOK AT THIS AND LOOK AT THE MUTATIONS.

THEY'LL WANT TO FIRST LOOK AT ANTIBODY RESPONSE.

THAT IS, AS THEY BEGIN TO MAKE THESE NEW VACCINES, YOU KNOW, MODERNA AND PFIZER ARE ALREADY ON IT IN TERMS OF MAKING NEW VACCINES, WE'LL HAVE TO SEE WHAT KIND OF ANTIBODY LEVELS THEY GET THERE.

SCIENCE HAS BEEN PART OF THE PROCESS, TWO TO FOUR WEEKS.

HOWEVER, IF YOU START TO SEE MORE AND MORE PATIENTS IN ICU, MORE AND MORE DEATH, THEN WE WILL HAVE THIS HARBINGER OF THE FUTURE HERE, WHICH WOULD BE PRETTY GRIM.

SO, AT THIS POINT, YOU KNOW, WE JUST DON'T KNOW HOW TRANSMISSIBLE IT'S GOING TO BE OR HOW VIRULENT IT'S GOING TO BE.

IT'S A MATTER OF LOOKING UNFORTUNATELY, NOT TO BE TOO GRIM, BUT TO LOOK AT THE BODY COUNTS.

>> AND I THINK THE NEXT QUESTION THAT IS ON THE MINDS OF SO MANY PEOPLE, INCLUDING SCIENTISTS LIKE YOURSELF WHO ARE STUDYING IS, IS THE EFFICACY OF THE VACCINE AGAINST THIS.

I THINK YOU MENTIONED THE TERM, YOU KNOW, YOU'RE WORRIED ABOUT A VARIANT THAT MIGHT EVADE THE VACCINES.

WHAT DO WE KNOW SO FAR, IF ANYTHING, ABOUT THE EFFICACY OF THE VACCINES THAT ARE OUT THERE RIGHT NOW WITH REGARD TO THE OMICRON VARIANT?

>> SO, THERE ARE TWO INTERESTING PIECES OF THIS.

ONE IN THE SOUTH AFRICA, IN 90% OF THOSE INDIVIDUALS WHO ARE IN ICUs WEREN'T VACCINATED.

SO, YOU MAY SURMISE THAT, YOU KNOW, THERE'S SOME PROTECTION THERE, BECAUSE THE VACCINATED ARE NOT IN THE ICU IN LARGE NUMBERS.

THE OTHER IS, AS THE PFIZER CHIEF MEDICAL OFFICER SAID, LOOK, YOU KNOW, 32 MUTATIONS IN THE SPIKE PROTEIN, THAT'S A FAIR NUMBER, BUT IT'S NOT ENOUGH TO BE ABLE TO EVADE VACCINE COMPLETELY.

IT'S JUST -- IT'S NOT QUITE A GOOD ENOUGH EFFORT.

SO, IT MAY BE LESS EVERY CASSIUS.

AND AGAIN, YOU'RE GOING TO LOOK AT THE ANTIBODY RESPONSE, HOW HIGH OR LOW IS IT IN THE TEST TUBE?

AND AT THAT POINT, WE'LL KNOLL IF THERE'S DIMINISHED EFFICACY OF THE VACCINE.

AND, OF COURSE, THE BIG COMPANIES LIKE PFIZER ARE ALREADY ON IT.

YOU KNOW, THIS MRNA TECHNOLOGY IS FABULOUS.

THESE ARE THE BEST VACCINES WE'VE EVER HAD IN HISTORY.

AND THE SPEED WITH WHICH THEY'LL BE ABLE TO MAKE A NEW OMICRON VACCINE IS STUNNING.

YOU KNOW, MAYBE A MONTH AWAY OR SO.

I'M REASSURED THAT THIS IS SOMETHING THAT CAN BE CONTAINED.

WHAT CAN'T BE CONTAINED, OF COURSE, IS THE MISINFORMATION WE'RE SUFFERING FROM WORLDWIDE.

>> I'M GOING TO COME BACK TO THAT IN A MINUTE.

BUT LET ME STAY ON VACCINES FOR A MINUTE.

SUPPOSE SOMEBODY IS WATCHING US, WATCHING THE NEWS ABOUT OMICRON AND THEY'RE SAYING, ALL RIGHT, I HAVEN'T GOTTEN MY VACCINE YET, OR PERHAPS I HAVEN'T GOTTEN MY BOOSTER YET AND THEY'RE SAYING, MAYBE I SHOULD WAIT TO SEE ABOUT THE EFFICACY OF THESE EXISTING ONES.

WHAT'S THE SUGGESTION, THE RECOMMENDATION YOU WOULD MAKE TO SOMEBODY WHO IS SORT OF TOYING WITH THAT IDEA OF WAITING?

>> SO, THE SAME ADVICE THE WHITE HOUSE HAD THIS MORNING, AND THAT IS, GET THAT BOOSTER SHOT.

I'VE GOTTEN MY BOOSTER SHOT RIGHT AWAY.

IT'S -- IT'S SUCH AN EFFECTIVE, GREAT VACCINE.

THERE MAY BE SOME REDUCED EFFICACY, BUT IT'S GOING TO HAVE SOME EFFECTIVENESS AND OF COURSE THERE'S LOTS OF DELTA LEFT AROUND.

WE DON'T KNOW THAT OMICRON IS GOING TO BE ABLE TO BEAT OUT DELTA, SO -- I WOULD SAY GET IT.

AND, YOU KNOW, OBVIOUSLY IT JUST TEARS ME APART THAT WE HAVE SOME SO HIGHLY EFFECTED AND PEOPLE ARE SO TERRIBLY MISLED BY THESE ANTI-VAXERS.

>> WHILE WE'RE ON THE NOTION OF ADVICE TO FOLKS OUT THERE, WHAT WOULD YOU SAY TO PEOPLE WHO ARE, FIRST OF ALL, SAYING, YOU KNOW, OH -- WHO ARE STARTING TO PANIC AND UNDERSTANDABLY SO, SAYING, OH, HERE WE ARE, WE THOUGHT WE WERE GETTING THINGS UNDER CONTROL AND NOW ANOTHER ONE EMERGES AND PEOPLE ARE SAYING, THIS COULD BE FAR MORE TRANSMISSIBLE THAN DELTA.

WHAT ADVICE WOULD YOU GIVE TO PEOPLE NOW AS WE'RE WAITING FOR THE SCIENCE TO CATCH UP TO OMICRON, TO GIVE US SOME HARDER ANSWERS TO THE QUESTIONS THAT YOU AND I WOULD BE DEALING WITH?

WHAT SHOULD WE ALL BE DOING?

>> SO, THIS IS AN INCREDIBLY EASY VIRUS TO BE ABLE TO PROTECT YOU FROM, REGARDLESS OF HOW VIRULENT IT IS OR, YOU KNOW, THE EFFECTIVENESS OF THE VACCINE, THAT IS, WEAR A HIGH FILTRATION MASK.

THEY'RE 96% TO 99% EFFECTIVE.

I USE THEM ALL THE TIME.

I TRAVEL ON AIRPLANES WITH THEM, I'M IN SCHOOLS, I'M IN HOSPITALS, I'M AT HIGH RISK WITH ASTHMA, BUT I REALLY DON'T WORRY.

SECONDLY, MAKE SURE THAT THE ROOM YOU GO INTO HAS A VERY HIGH AIR FLOW.

MAYBE JUST OPENING WINDOWS AND DOORS.

>> WHY IS THAT SO IMPORTANT, BOB?

YOU AND I HAVE TALKED ABOUT THIS BEFORE.

EXPLAIN TO US, WHY IS THAT SO IMPORTANT?

>> SO, THERE'S A WONDERFUL "NEW YORK TIMES" ILLUSTRATION AND WHAT IT SHOWS IS THAT A CLASSROOM, THERE'S ONE INDIVIDUAL INFECTED IN THAT CLASSROOM AND WITH POOR AIR CIRCULATION, YOU SEE THE VIRUS START UP AND DOWN AND UP AND DOWN AND UP AND DOWN UNTIL IT IS A CESSPOOL OF VIRUS.

THE VIRUS IS EVERY PLACE.

THIS VIRUS IS VERY LIGHT, IT CAN STAY AIRBORNE AND TRAVEL.

AND I THINK THAT'S WHAT PEOPLE HAVE MISSED, IT CAN TRAVEL.

IT'S NOT THIS OLD SENSE THAT YOU COUGH AND A DROPLET GOES OUT, YOU WEAR A MASK AND YOU MISS THE DROPLET -- NO.

IT'S AIRBORNE.

IT'S TELL THINK.

COULD I TRAVEL AROUND WITH A CARBON DIOXIDE MONITOR, IF THE LEVEL'S BELOW 806, I FEEL VERY CONFIDENT IT'S GOOD AIR.

THE MAIN REASON WE SAW A BIG SOUTH IN THE SUMMER, WHEN PEOPLE WENT INDOORS IN AIR CONDITIONING, WE DIDN'T HAVE GOOD VENTILATION.

AND NOW IN THE NORTH, YOU HAVE A BIG SPIKE BECAUSE PEOPLE GO INDOORS, YOU HAVE VERY POOR AIR CIRCULATION AND I FAULT THE CDC AND THE GOVERNMENT FROM NOT MAKING IT A BIGGER ISSUE.

HIGH FILTRATION MASKS, GREAT VENTILATION, YOU HAVE THE VACCINE.

YOU KNOW, IN TERMS OF WEIGHING PROS AND CONS, YOU KNOW, THE PRO IS, YOU AVOID DYING, YOU AVOID AN ICU VISIT IN ALL LIKELIHOOD AND YOU ALSO AVOID INFECTING PERHAPS EVEN KILLING OTHERS.

SO, I THINK THAT IT'S INCREDIBLY SIMPLE AND WE'VE MADE IT AMAZINGLY COMPLEX AND ALARMING WHERE IT REALLY ISN'T.

>> LET ME ASK YOU THIS.

YOU'VE BEEN DOING THIS A LONG TIME.

AS A JOURNALIST, AS A PHYSICIAN, AS A SCIENTIST.

HAVE YOU EVER SEEN A SITUATION WHERE WE HAVE SO POLITICIZED A MEDICAL TREATMENT, A MEDICAL TREATMENT THAT HAS BEEN ENDORSED BY SCIENTISTS THROUGHOUT THE WORLD?

AND WHERE IT'S BECOME A POLITICAL ISSUE?

TALKING ABOUT THE VACCINE NOW, AS OPPOSED TO A MEDICAL OR SCIENTIFIC ISSUE?

>> YOU KNOW, JACK, I'VE NEVER SEEN ANYTHING LIKE THIS.

I LITERALLY WANT TO PULL MY HAIR OUT, I'M SO FRUSTRATED AND SORT OF VISCERALLY UPSET.

WE HAVE THIS FABULOUS SOLUTION AND WITH THIS MISINFODEMIC, SO MANY INNOCENT PEOPLE ARE DYING.

THEY DON'T TRUST THE GOVERNMENT, THE PHARMACEUTICAL COMPANIES, THEY DON'T TRUST SCIENTISTS OR MEDICAL CENTERS AND IT'S TERRIBLE.

AND SO, THEY TURN TO TERRIBLE, TERRIBLE SOURCES OF INFORMATION.

SO, THERE'S A BIT OF THIS BACK DURING THE POLIO EPIDEMIC.

I REMEMBER WAITING FOR THE POLIO VACCINE BACK THEN.

>> I REMEMBER THE SAME THING.

YOU AND I ARE SORT OF THE SAME AGE.

I REMEMBER THAT.

BUT EVERYBODY -- IT WAS A LITTLE FRIGHTENING, BECAUSE IT WAS SO NEW, THE DISEASE WAS SO FRIGHTENING, BUT EVENTUALLY PEOPLE SAID, ALL RIGHT, FINE, LET'S DO THIS.

AND LOOK WHAT IT DID TO POLIO.

>> YEAH, AND YOU LOOK AT WHAT'S HAPPENED WITH SMALLPOX AND POLIO.

IT'S BEEN A MIRACLE.

IN AFRICA, IT'S INTERESTING THAT THERE'S A TREMENDOUS DISTRUST OF THE SORT OF, YOU KNOW, COLONIAL ERA AND THEY MISTRUST PHARMACEUTICAL COMPANIES, THEY MISTRUST WESTERN POWERS.

AND SO, YOU KNOW, YOU REALLY WANT TO SHAKE PEOPLE.

I THINK PART OF IT IS, YOU KNOW, IN THIS NEW ERA, PEOPLE FEEL THEY CAN STRING THREE, WE'LL CALL THEM FACTS, THREE STATEMENTS TOGETHER, THEY HAVE A NARRATIVE AND THEY BELIEVE IN THAT NARRATIVE.

I THINK ONE DIFFICULTY IS, AS A PHYSICIAN, WE MAKE MEDICAL DECISIONS, VERY COMPLEX.

YOU HAVE A WHOLE SPREADSHEET OF PROS AND A WHOLE SPREADSHEET OF CONS.

AND I THINK THAT'S WHAT'S TROUBLING PEOPLE.

THEY HEAR ALL THESE CONS.

SOME OF THEM ARE ACCURATE.

FOR INSTANCE, ASTRAZENECA, THERE WERE SOME CASES OF BLOOD CLOTS.

THERE HAVE BEEN SOME IN INFREQUENT INSTANCES OF MYOCARDITIS.

BUT SURE, YEAH, WITH ANY -- YOU GIVE 150 MILLION OR MORE PEOPLE, YOU'RE GOING TO HAVE A MINOR COMPLICATION.

BUT IF YOU WEIGH THAT AGAINST YOUR OWN DEATH, ENDING UP IN THE ICU, ENDING UP SICK OR ENDING UP WITH LONG COVID OR THE CHANCE THAT YOU INFECT SOMEBODY ELSE AND INADVERTENTLY KILL THEM, I THINK IT'S A NO BRAINER.

IT'S DIFFICULT, BUT IT IS A NO BRAINER.

I WOULD JUST SAY, GET OFF THE FENCE AND GET THE VACCINE.

I'M NOT POLITICAL.

I'M NOT LEFT, I'M NOT RIGHT.

I'M NOT WITH A POLITICAL PARTY.

BUT I DO THINK THAT, YOU KNOW, THIS ANTI-VAXER MESSAGE HAS JUMPED TO THE FOREFRONT AS THE NUMBER ONE BEST MESSAGE FOR POLITICAL PARTIES.

GERMANY IS AN EXAMPLE.

THEY'RE NOT JUST RED STATES, THEY'RE CRIMSON STATES, THEY'RE SO RED.

AND THEY FOUND IT'S THEIR NUMBER ONE TOPTOPIC.

THEY HAVE FOUND THIS ANTI-VAXER PLATFORM, THAT'S THE MOST POPULAR.

TRAGICALLY.

>> YEAH.

THAT'S THE PROBLEM.

IT'S TRAGIC.

THE CONSEQUENCES CAN BE TRAGIC.

LET ME JUMP FROM VACCINES TO TREATMENTS, IF I CAN.

WE HAVE ABOUT FIVE MINUTES LEFT IN OUR CONVERSATION, SO BRING US UP TO DATE IN WHAT WE'RE SEEING SO FAR IN TERMS OF THE VARIOUS COMPANIES AND THE VARIOUS APPROACHES THAT THEY HAVE FOR MEDICAL TREATMENT, ONCE YOU HAVE CONTRACTED COVID.

>> YOU KNOW, UP UNTIL NOW, WE'VE HAD INTRAVENOUS TREATMENTS.

YOU HAVE TO GO TO THE HOSPITAL, PUT IN A LINE AND IT'S FAIRLY COMPLEX.

SO, NOW THERE ARE PILLS.

FIRST IS MERCK, THERE'S SOME EFFICACY THERE, ENOUGH THAT, YOU KNOW, IT BROKE THE VOTE AND THE FDA DID APPROVE IT AND I BELIEVE IT'S QUICKLY AVAILABLE, IF NOT AVAILABLE RIGHT NOW.

PFIZER EXPECTS, AND THEY HAVE THEIR PAPERWORK IN, TO HAVE AN APPROVAL WITHIN WEEKS AND THEY HAVE ALREADY SHIPPED DOSES THROUGHOUT THE UNITED STATES AND EUROPE.

THE PFIZER LOOKS LIKE IT'S FAR MORE EVERY CAUTIOUS IN TERMS OF DEATH AND ICU VISITS AND I THINK THAT FOR AN INDIVIDUAL WHO TESTS POSITIVE, WHO IS OLDER, SHOULD START TAKING THE PILLS RIGHT AWAY.

IT'S GOING TO BE A REAL GAME-CHANGE EVERY.

AND FOR THOSE WHO HAVEN'T BEEN VACCINATED AND START TO GET ILL EARLY, IT COULD BE A HUGE GAME-CHANGER.

THE DIFFICULTY WILL BE GETTING ENOUGH OF IT OUT AND HAVING PEOPLE BELIEVE IN IT SO THEY TAKE THIS.

SO, THIS COULD BE SOMETHING THAT REALLY DOES CHANGE THE FACE OF THE EPIDEMIC, YOU KNOW, ONE WOULD HOPE.

AND IT IS, TO MY MIND, REMARKABLE, BOTH UNIVERSITY LABORATORIES AND THE PHARMACEUTICAL LABORATORIES, HOW GOOD THESE VACCINES ARE, HOW GOOD THESE MEDICATIONS ARE.

THIS WOULD HAVE TAKEN, YOU KNOW, TEN YEARS IN THE PAST TO BE ABLE TO ASSAULT A PANDEMIC LIKE THIS, BUT NOW, YOU KNOW, IT'S MONTHS AND IT'S A MIRACLE, IT'S FANTASTIC.

IT'S A GREAT, GREAT NEW AGE.

>> ARE YOU BELIEVING A CONSEQUENCE OF THE DEVELOPMENT OF TREATMENTS, THE TREATMENT MODALITIES MIGHT HAVE SORT OF AN UNDESIRED CONSEQUENCE OF PEOPLE SAYING, WELL, MAYBE I DON'T NEED THE VACCINE THEN, IF THERE'S MEDICATION OUT THERE THAT I CAN USE TO TREAT THIS?

ARE YOU CONCERNED THAT MIGHT BE A CONSEQUENCE?

>> SO, JACK, I AM THE BIGGEST PROPONENT OF THE SCHOOL OF UNINTENDED CONSEQUENCES.

AND I THINK YOU'RE DEAD RIGHT.

PEOPLE WILL GO, WELL, I HAVE A PILL, I DON'T NEED A VACCINE.

SO SURE.

I THINK THAT IF PEOPLE SEE THE EFFICACY AND THEY'RE WILLING TO TAKE THE PILL, THEY MAY SAY, HEY, I'M COVERED.

>> HOPEFULLY THE MESSAGE WILL GET OUT THAT THAT DOESN'T MEAN YOU DON'T TAKE IT.

GOT ABOUT TWO MINUTES LEFT.

SO, LET'S SORT OF WRAP THIS UP WITH A -- YOUR RECOMMENDATIONS.

WE TALKED ABOUT SOME OF THEM BEFORE.

BUT JUST OVERALL PICTURE, WHAT YOU WOULD SAY TO PEOPLE OUT THERE IN TERMS OF HOW THEY SHOULD VIEW THIS EMERGENCE NOW AND WHAT THEY SHOULD BE DOING WITH THEIR LIVES, ESPECIALLY HEADING INTO THE HOLIDAYS?

>> WELL, YOU KNOW, MY OLDER SON SAID, DAD, JUST LIVE YOUR LIFE, AND THEY'RE RIGHT.

BUT IT'S SO EASY FOR US TO BE ABLE TO LIVE OURLIVES.

WEAR A HIGH FILTRATION MASK, THERE'S SWISS TECHNOLOGY, KOREAN TECHNOLOGY, 3M IN THE UNITED STATES.

GET A MASK FROM A GOOD DISTRIBUTOR.

I USE IT EVERY PLACE.

I'M AT HIGH RISK AND THEY'VE BEEN TERRIFIC.

MAKE SURE YOU DON'T GO IN A ROOM THAT ISN'T INCREDIBLY WELL VENTILATED.

EITHER MEASURE THE CO2 OR MAKE SURE THE WINDOWS OR DOORS OR OPEN.

AND FINALLY, GET THE VACCINE.

SURE, THERE ARE CONS, SURE THERE ARE RISKS, AS THERE ARE WITH ANYTHING.

ANY TIME YOU GIVE A MEDICATION OR VACCINE TO 150 MILLION PEOPLE, YOU'RE GOING TO SEE SOME VERY MINOR AND RARE SIDE EFFECTS, BUT ON BALANCE, YOU CAN SAVE YOUR LIFE, IF YOU HAVE YOUNG CHILDREN, YOU'RE NOT GOING TO LEAVE THEM BEHIND.

SO, WEAR THAT MASK.

MAKE SURE YOU'RE IN A WELL VENTILATED ROOM.

GET THE VACCINE AND GO ON LIVING YOUR LIFE.

>> IF WE CAN AVOID THE MISINFODEMIC YOU TALKED ABOUT, LOOK TO SCIENCE TO PROVIDE ANSWERS FOR ALL OF US.

DR. BOB ARNOT, ALWAYS A PLEASURE TO GET SOME -- HAVE SOME TIME TO CHAT WITH YOU.

I ALWAYS FEEL LIKE I KNOW SO MUCH MORE AFTER AND IT'S VERY VALUABLE INFORMATION.

BOB, ALWAYS A PLEASURE.

STAY SAFE, STAY WELL AND WE'LL TALK SOON AGAIN.

>> THANK YOU FOR SUCH INSIGHT, WONDERFUL QUESTIONS AND YOUR CONCERN.

YOU ARE A GREAT TREASURE TO YOUR VIEWERS AND -- >> KIND OF YOU.

KIND OF YOU TO SAY, BOB, BE WELL.

>> THANKS AGAIN.

>>> "METROFOCUS" IS MADE POSSIBLE BY -- SUE AND EDGAR WACHENHEIM III, SYLVIA A.

AND SIMON B. POYTA PROGRAMING ENDOWMENT TO FIGHT ANTI-SEMITISM, THE PETER G. PETERSON AND JOAN GANZ COONEY FUND, BERNARD AND DENISE SCHWARTZ, BARBARA HOPE ZUCKERBERG, THE AMBROSE MONELL FOUNDATION.

AND BY -- JANET PRINDLE SEIDLER, JODY AND JOHN ARNHOLD, CHERYL AND PHILIP MILSTEIN FAMILY, JUDY AND JOSH WESTON, DR. ROBERT C. AND TINA SOHN