>>> THE BITTERLY CONTESTED CLIMATE BILL PASSES THE SENATE THIS FRIDAY OVER THE GOVERNOR'S OBJECTIONS.

THE FINANCIAL IMPACT ON LOW INCOME HOMEOWNERS, UNKNOWN.

>> WE NEED THE LEGISLATURE TO FULLY UNDERSTAND THE IMPACTS OF THIS BILL AND BE HONEST WITH VERMONTERS ABOUT THOSE VERY REAL COSTS AND COMPLICATIONS.

THAT'S IT.

THAT'S OUR REQUEST.

>> ONE MEASURE OF DISCONTENT, THE SPECTACLE GREETING SENATORS ON THEIR WAY INTO THE CHAMBER.

A STATEHOUSE UPDATE AS LAWMAKERS HEAD HOME FOR A WEEK-LONG BREAK.

>>> PLUS A LOOK AHEAD AT THE UPCOMING TOWN MEETING.

A LOT TO CONSIDER.

>>> AND HOW DO YOU DEFINE MILK?

SUDDENLY A REAL QUESTION.

AHEAD ON "VERMONT THIS WEEK."

>>> FROM THE VERMONT PUBLIC STUDIO IN WINOOSKI, THIS IS "VERMONT THIS WEEK" SHOW.

HERE IS MODERATOR STEWART LEDBETTER.

>> WELCOME, EVERYONE.

IT IS FRIDAY, MARCH 3rd, 2023.

I'M STEWART LEDBETTER.

AROUND THE TABLE THIS WEEK WE ARE PLEASED TO WELCOME BACK LIAM ELDER CONNORS, A REPORTER WITH VERMONT PUBLIC.

SARAH MEARHOFF IS HERE, SHE COVERS POLITICS FOR VTDIGGER.

AND EMERSON LYNN JOIN US, ST. ALBANS MESSENGER.

THANK YOU ALL VERY MUCH.

AS THE LEGISLATURE LEAVES TOWN FOR TOWN MEETING BREAK, WE WANT TO GET YOU UP TO DATE.

AND NOTHING SEEMED TO OVERSHADOW THIS WEEK THE DEBATE OVER S5, THE YEAR'S BIG CLIMATE CHANGE BILL THAT AIMS TO SORT OF WE KNOW VERMONTERS OVER TIME OFF OF FOSSIL FUELS.

THE DEBATE ON THURSDAY ON THE FLOOR OF THE STATE SENATE WENT ON FOR MORE THAN THREE HOURS.

AND WE'LL GIVE YOU A LITTLE TASTE.

>> OUR FOSSIL FUEL USE ALSO COMES WITH A SECOND COST.

THE IMPACT TO OUR ENVIRONMENT.

VERMONT HAS THE HIGHEST LEVEL OF GREENHOUSE GAS POLLUTION PER PERSON IN THE NORTHEAST.

WE ARE NOT AS GREEN AS WE MIGHT HOPE OR THINK.

>> WOULD YOU WALK INTO YOUR TOWN MEETING NEXT TUESDAY AND VOTE FOR A SCHOOL BUDGET IF THE SCHOOL BOARD JUST STOOD UP AND SAID, WE'RE GOING TO DO ALL THESE STUDIES, BUT WE WOULD LIKE TO HAVE YOU PASS OUR BUDGET WITHOUT ANY INFORMATION?

>> TWO DEMOCRATS SPLITTING OVER SENATE BILL 5, THE PRELIMINARY VOTE, THOUGH, IN THE SENATE 19-10.

WE'LL COME BACK TO THAT NUMBER.

BUT EMERSON, THIS IS A FIERCELY OPPOSED, NO SURPRISE, BY THE FUEL DEALERS.

EVEN SOME IN THE ADMINISTRATION THINKS THE LEGISLATURE IS JUMPING THE GUN.

>> IT'S THE FEAR OF THE UNKNOWN RIGHT NOW.

>> RIGHT.

>> BECAUSE YOU HAVE A BILL, YOU KNOW, THAT DID PASS, BUT NOT COMFORTABLY AT ALL.

AND ONE OF THE I THOUGHT PRETTY INTERESTING THINGS THAT HAPPENED IN THE LAST MINUTES OF IT IS WHEN ONE OF THE AUTHORS, CHRIS BRAY, DECIDED TO TAKE THE BILL FROM BEING A BILL TO BEING A STUDY.

AND HE SAID, THIS IS A BIT OF A STEP BACK TO ADDRESS THE CONCERNS THAT PEOPLE HAVE IN TERMS OF NOT KNOWING, YOU KNOW, WHAT THE COSTS WERE GOING TO BE, BECAUSE THAT'S REALLY THE SALIENT ARGUMENT THE GOVERNOR MADE, AND THE REPUBLICANS AND SOME DEMOCRATS.

WHAT HAPPENS NOW, IF THE BILL WERE TO PASS AND BE SIGNED INTO LAW, YOU WOULD HAVE THE PUBLIC UTILITIES COMMISSION HAVE THE RESPONSIBILITY OF DETERMINING WHAT THESE COSTS WERE, AND THEN TWO YEARS LATER, YOU WOULD HAVE THE LEGISLATURE WOULD HAVE TO REVOTE AGAIN.

BUT STILL, IT'S ONE OF THOSE PIECES OF LEGISLATION THAT A LOT OF PARTICULARLY THE MODERATES ARE VERY UNCOMFORTABLE WITH, BECAUSE THEY KNOW IT COULD BE A REALLY TOUGH ISSUE FOR THEM IF THE OPPOSITION GOES TO THE POLLS SAYING, WHAT DID YOU DO, YOU KNOW, WHEN PEOPLE GET -- HAVE THEIR PROPANE OR WHATEVER JUMPED UP 70 CENTS A GALLON, PEOPLE SCREAM.

>> OH, YEAH.

REMEMBER THE FIGHTS MONTPELIER USED TO HAVE OVER RAISING THE GAS TAX A DIME?

>> ABSOLUTELY.

>> THIS WAS THE SCENE, THOUGH, AS SENATORS WERE MAKING THEIR WAY TO THE CHAMBER TO HAVE THIS VOTE.

YOU DON'T THINK THE FUEL DEALERS IN OUR STATE ARE ORGANIZED?

YOU BET THEY ARE.

AND, YOU KNOW, THESE GUYS WERE LINING THE HALLS, AND IN THE GALLERY, HOLDING SIGNS.

THERE WERE POLICE THERE.

THERE WAS NO PROBLEM OR ANYTHING, BUT SENATORS HAVE BEEN HAMMERED WITH MESSAGES FROM FOLKS BACK HOME ASKING THEM TO SLOW DOWN ON THIS.

THE REAL ISSUE IS THE TRANSITIONAL COST FROM WHAT WE HAVE NOW TO HAVING EVERYBODY HAVE WOOD HEAT AND WEATHERIZED HOMES AND ELECTRIC HEAT PUMPS.

>> I WAS GOING TO SAY, THE SHORT TERM COST INCREASE IS REALLY THE CONCERN HERE.

STUDIES HAVE SHOWN PROBABLY IN THE LONG TERM, SHIFTING AWAY FROM FOSSIL FUELS IS ACTUALLY GOING TO CHEAPER AND ALSO MORE RELIABLE FOR PEOPLE.

THE PRICES AREN'T GOING TO BE AS VOLATILE AS THE FOSSIL FUEL PRICES AND PROPANE AND HEATING OIL THAT PEOPLE ARE USING.

BUT IT IS THAT SORT OF INTERIM STEP WHERE, ONE, WE DON'T EVEN RECALL KNOW WHAT THAT'S GOING TO LOOK LIKE, LIKE EMERSON WAS SAYING, AND TWO, HOW ARE YOU GOING TO GET PEOPLE FROM WHERE THEY ARE NOW TO THAT POINT WHERE WE'RE NOT RELYING ON FOSSIL FUELS.

>> I THINK YOU'RE RIGHT, AND ONE OF THE INTERESTING PART OF THIS, LOOKING FROM 30,000 FEET UP, LIAM, THERE'S ALSO A CONCERN AMONG ENVIRONMENTALISTS WHO LOOK AT THIS AND GO, YOU KNOW, WE HAVE TO GET THIS RIGHT, BECAUSE IF YOU PASS SOMETHING, AND THIS WAS ONE OF THE MAJOR CONCERNS, IF YOU PASS SOMETHING, AND THEN IT BECOMES SOMETHING MUCH LARGER THAN -- A LOT MORE DIFFICULT THAN YOU THOUGHT, AND YOU FAIL, THEN ONE OF THE WHOLE PROBLEMS WITH THIS IS, HOW DOES THE PUBLIC BELIEVE YOU GOING FORWARD ON SOMETHING THAT'S AS CRUCIAL AS CLIMATE CHANGE?

AND SO IS THERE REALLY A DIFFERENCE BETWEEN DOING IT INSTANTLY, YOU KNOW, OR VERY QUICKLY, BY 2026, GETTING STARTED, AND ACCOMPLISHING THINGS BY 2030, IS THERE A REAL DIFFERENCE BETWEEN 2030 AND 2035, IF IT'S THE DIFFERENCE BETWEEN DOING SOMETHING WELL AND NOT DOING IT WELL?

I THINK THAT'S ONE OF THE GOVERNOR'S COMPLAINTS.

>> ABSOLUTELY, THE AGENCY OF NATURAL RESOURCES HAS HIRED A CONSULTANT TO ANSWER SOME OF THESE QUESTIONS WITH MORE PRECISION.

THE STUDY IS EXPECTED TO BE FINISHED IN JUNE.

SO HE'S PUSHING LAWMAKERS TO WAIT FOR THOSE ANSWERS.

AT HIS PRESS BRIEFING ON WEDNESDAY, IT WAS ALL ABOUT S5, AND HE BROUGHT IN AN ELECTRICAL CONTRACTOR, AS YOU KNOW, SARAH, YOU WERE THERE, WHO SAID THERE IS NO WAY VERMONT'S ELECTRICAL CONTRACTORS HAVE THE STAFF, NOR WILL THEY ANYTIME SOON, TO DO THESE WHOLESALE ELECTRICAL INSTALLATIONS.

THEY'RE TURNING BUSINESS AWAY NOW.

AND HE SAID THERE ARE OTHER QUESTIONS ABOUT THE CAPACITY OF THE ELECTRIC GRID AND WHERE WE'RE GOING TO GET ALL OF THIS ELECTRICITY TO POWER NOT JUST HEAT PUMPS BUT OUR ELECTRIC CARS, SOMETHING -- A TRANSITION HE SAID HE SUPPORTS, BUT HE WAS ASKED WHETHER -- WHERE THE POWER WOULD COME FROM, HE SAID CANADIAN HYDROELECTRICITY, FOR ONE.

AND MAYBE EVEN NEW NUCLEAR POWER GENERATION IN OUR STATE.

>> I DON'T THINK THAT SHOULD BE OFF THE TABLE IN THE FUTURE, TO BE HONEST WITH YOU.

THERE'S BEEN ADVANCEMENTS IN NUCLEAR.

AND SO I THINK WE -- EVERYTHING SHOULD BE ON THE TABLE, SO TO SPEAK, IF WE'RE REALLY SERIOUS ABOUT DECARBONIZATION.

>> WE HAVEN'T TALKED ABOUT NUCLEAR GENERATION IN VERMONT IN A WHILE, EMERSON.

>> OF COURSE THE IRONY IS THAT WE'RE THE STATE THAT SHUT OFF 40% OF OUR CLEAN ENERGY WHEN WE SHUT DOWN VERMONT YANKEE.

NO, THERE'S A WHOLE NEW RESEARCH GOING ON WITH NUCLEAR POWER.

THIS IS BILL GATES' BIG THING, IN TERMS OF -- AND MANY OTHERS, IN TERMS OF, HEY, WE CAN DO THIS ON A SMALL FOOTPRINT.

I THINK THE KEY THING THERE IS THAT ENVIRONMENTALISTS ARE HAVING TO DEAL WITH, IF CLIMATE CHANGE IS AN EXISTENTIAL THREAT, THEN TREAT IT EXISTENTIALLY.

SO YOU REALLY HAVE TO COME UP WITH THINGS, YOU KNOW, OUT OF THE BOX.

NUCLEAR POWER BEING ONE OF THEM.

>> THE PLANT THAT WE HAD IN VERMONT THAT SHUT DOWN IN 2014 WAS DESIGNED DURING THE KENNEDY ADMINISTRATION.

THE GOVERNOR'S POINT IS, LOOK AT IT, BECAUSE PERHAPS A LOT HAS CHANGED.

ANYWAY, THIS BILL MOVES TO THE HOUSE NOW, AND WILL BE BACK.

BUT AS LAWMAKERS LEAVE, SARAH, GET US UP TO DATE ABOUT SORT OF WHERE WE ARE EIGHT WEEKS INTO THIS SESSION, ON FRIDAY THE LEGISLATURE SENT THE GOVERNOR OF THE BUDGET ADJUSTMENT ACT, WHICH IS BIG THIS YEAR.

>> IT IS.

IT RAISES GENERAL FUND SPENDING BY $68 MILLION THIS YEAR.

YOU KNOW, THE BUDGET ADJUSTMENT ACT TYPICALLY IS NOT THAT SEXY OF A PIECE OF LEGISLATION.

IT'S A MID-YEAR BUDGET ADJUSTMENT TO THE STATE'S TOTAL SPENDING.

BUT THIS YEAR, BECAUSE OF ALL OF THE MONEY THAT THE STATE HAS GOTTEN OVER THE PAST COUPLE OF YEARS FROM THE FEDS, THESE BUDGET ADJUSTMENT ACTS HAVE BECOME BIGGER AND BIGGER.

AND THE BIG CONFLICT IN THIS ONE WAS WHETHER TO CONTINUE WITH EMERGENCY HOUSING PROVISIONS THAT VERMONT HAS FOR PEOPLE EXPERIENCING HOMELESSNESS.

THE DEAL THAT THE HOUSE AND THE SENATE STRUCK WAS THAT THINGS WILL CONTINUE AS THEY ARE WITH THE HOTEL/MOTEL HOUSING PROGRAM FOR PEOPLE EXPERIENCING HOMELESSNESS THROUGH MAY 31st.

AND AFTER THAT POINT, THERE ARE CERTAIN POPULATIONS THAT WILL BE PRIORITIZED, AND I GUESS YOU COULD SAY TRIAGED, FOR THESE HOUSING PROTECTIONS.

PEOPLE WHO ARE PREGNANT, FAMILIES, PEOPLE WHO HAVE DISABILITIES, THOSE SORTS OF PEOPLE.

>> THE HOUSE ON FRIDAY TOOK UP A COUPLE OF -- WELL, I'LL HAVE YOU EXPLAIN IT.

ONE IS PRETTY STRAIGHTFORWARD, BARRING CHILD MARRIAGES.

MARRIAGES BY ANYONE UNDER 18.

>> YES.

>> A SECOND COVERING BIRTH CONTROL, A TERM WITH WHICH I WAS UNFAMILIAR, CALLED STEALTHING.

WHAT DO WE NEED TO KNOW?

>> THE CHILD MARRIAGE BILL GETS RID OF AN EXCEPTION TO -- I MEAN, IN ORDER FOR SOMEONE TO CONSENT TO BE MARRIED, RIGHT NOW, IF YOU HAVE THE CONSENT OF A PARENT, THEN YOU CAN GET MARRIED BEFORE YOU'RE 18 IN VERMONT.

THAT GETS RID OF THAT.

IF THIS BILL IS SIGNED INTO LAW, 18 WILL BE THE AGE OF CONSENT FOR MARRIAGE.

AND THEN THE STEALTHING BILL, WHICH WAS PASSED BY THE HOUSE JUST TODAY, JUST THIS MORNING, IT ESTABLISHES CIVIL PENALTIES FOR THE NONCONSENSUAL REMOVAL OF A CONDOM DURING OR BEFORE SEX.

AND THIS IS AN ACT THAT HAS BECOME -- I MEAN, IT'S BEEN AROUND FOR A LONG TIME BUT IT'S BECOME A LITTLE MORE UBIQUITOUS IN RECENT YEARS, AND IT HAS GARNERED QUITE A BIT OF ATTENTION ESPECIALLY IN COLLEGE CAMPUS CIRCLES, I WOULD SAY.

AND PEOPLE, PROPONENTS OF THIS BILL, SAY THAT TO DO THIS IS A WAY OF VIOLATING SOMEONE, THEY SAY IT'S AKIN TO SEXUAL ASSAULT, SO THEY WANT TO ESTABLISH CIVIL PENALTIES FOR DOING IT.

>> ANOTHER BILL THAT A LOT OF US ARE WATCHING IS SENATE BILL 4.

THIS IS JUVENILE JUSTICE AND FIREARMS BILL, LIAM, IT MOVED OUT OF THE JUDICIARY COMMITTEE IN THE SENATE THIS WEEK.

>> IT WENT OVER TO THE SENATE APPROPRIATIONS COMMITTEE.

BUT THE BILL WOULD DO A COUPLE OF THINGS.

NOTABLE ONES WOULD BE PREACHING STRAW PURCHASES OF FIREARMS, SOMEBODY BUYING A GUN FOR SOMEBODY ELSE WHO MAYBE ISN'T ABLE TO BUY A FIREARM.

IT WOULD ALSO AUTOMATICALLY PUT CERTAIN CRIMES COMMITTED BY JUVENILES INTO ADULT COURT UNLESS THE STATE'S ATTORNEY PETITIONS FOR THAT TO BE A YOUTHFUL OFFENDER.

THOSE ARE TWO OF THE MAIN ONES I SAW IN THERE.

TO ME, WHAT'S INTERESTING ABOUT WATCHING THIS BILL, IS, YOU KNOW, IN SOME WAYS THESE DON'T SEEM AS SIGNIFICANT AS SOME OF THE OTHER GUN BILLS THAT WE'VE SEEN.

AND I HAVEN'T SEEN AS MUCH OPPOSITION TO THIS COME UP YET.

THAT DOESN'T MEAN IT'S NOT GOING TO HAPPEN.

BUT I'M CURIOUS TO SEE WHERE IT GOES.

I'M ALSO CURIOUS ABOUT WHERE THE JUVENILE ANGLE CAME OUT, IT WAS A SURPRISING THING TO ME TO SEE STUCK IN THERE AMONG SOME OF THE OTHER ISSUES.

I GUESS IT'S ONE THAT'S CAUGHT LAWMAKERS' ATTENTION.

>> AND PROBABLY THE NUMBER ONE ISSUE TO A LOT OF VERMONTERS IS THE HOUSING CRISIS.

AND THERE IS THIS UNUSUAL COALITION OF FORCES AT THE STATEHOUSE THIS YEAR THAT IS WILLING TO DO MORE THAN JUST THROW MONEY AT CONSTRUCTION AND ALSO LOOK AT ACT 250 REFORM AND LOCAL ZONING.

AND, WELL, THE VERMONT CHAMBER OF COMMERCE PUT OUT A STATEMENT, OVERJOYED THAT THIS THING HAD PASSED OUT OF THE SENATE ECONOMIC DEVELOPMENT AND HOUSING COMMITTEE.

S100, THEY SAID, WOULD MAKE MEANINGFUL PROGRESS TO CREATE P MORE HOUSING BUT ONLY IF THE LEGISLATION IS NOT STRIPPED OF ITS ZONING ELEMENTS.

NO LONGER CAN WE ALLOW REGULATORY PROCESSES BE USED TO DERAIL HOUSING OPPORTUNITIES, IT SAYS.

THIS IS A CHANGE TO SEE THE DEMOCRATIC CHAIR OF THE COMMITTEE REALLY GET BEHIND SOMETHING THAT MAY BE UNPOPULAR IN LOCAL COMMUNITIES.

>> I THINK THAT'S TRUE.

>> IT'S UNPOPULAR, YEAH.

>> WHICH MEANS WE PROBABLY ARE DOING SOMETHING CORRECT, RIGHT?

YOU CAN'T REALLY ADDRESS THE HOUSING CRISIS, WHICH IS LIKE THE NUMBER ONE ISSUE ACROSS THE STATE, UNLESS YOU DEAL WITH LOCAL REGULATIONS.

THIS IS WHERE IT ALL HAPPENS, IS LOCAL COMMUNITIES AND ZONING.

AND THE WAY WE'RE SET UP RIGHT NOW, VERMONT HAS -- WE'RE NUMBER ONE IN THE COUNTRY WITH THE LARGEST LOT SIZES BY FAR.

OUR LOT SIZES ARE SO MUCH LARGER THAN ANYBODY ELSE'S.

AND THAT ALSO PREVENTS US FROM EVER CREATING DENSITY IN HOUSING.

SO TO REALLY DEAL WITH THIS YOU HAVE TO PASS LEGISLATION DEALING WITH LOCAL ZONING SO YOU CAN INCREASE DENSITY.

NOT ONLY IS THAT A LOCAL ISSUE BUT YOU ALSO HAVE TO DEAL WITH ACT 250 IN TERMS OF, YOU KNOW, YOU CAN'T ALLOW PEOPLE TO THROW THINGS UP SO YOU VERY EASILY CAN KNOCK OUT BUILDING PROPOSALS.

BUT THAT AFFECTS EVERYBODY.

EVERYBODY.

WHEN YOU OWN A HOME, YOUR NET WORTH IS A BIG -- A BIG SHARE OF YOUR NET WORTH IS TIED UP IN THE VALUE OF YOUR HOME.

IF YOU THINK THAT CHANGING ZONING AFFECTS THAT, YOU'LL BE ASKING QUESTIONS.

AND IT GOES ALL THE WAY THROUGH.

SO, YOU KNOW, YOU HAVE TO GIVE HIGH MARKS TO THE SENATE FOR BEING ABLE TO PUSH THIS, BECAUSE THERE IS NO WAY THAT THIS PIECE OF LEGISLATION WOULD BE HAPPENING TEN YEARS AGO.

>> THEY BRING IN THIS EQUITY ARGUMENT NOW, THAT IF YOU DON'T HAVE DENSITY, THE PER UNIT COST IN TOWN CENTERS IS OUT OF REACH FOR A LOT OF LOWER INCOME FOLKS.

>> ABSOLUTELY.

AND THERE IS ALSO PLENTY OF MONEY IN BOTH THE FY24 BUDGET PROPOSAL AND IN THE BUDGET ADJUSTMENT THAT WAS JUST PASSED.

SO IT'S NOT JUST A ZONING AND ACT 250 FIX HERE.

ALL RIGHT.

SO THAT'S WHERE WE ARE, AS LAWMAKERS GO HOME FOR THE TOWN MEETING BREAK.

WE'LL SHIFT TO TOWN MEETING IN JUST A MOMENT.

>>> BUT IN NEW YORK THIS WEEK, EMERSON, WE SAW ANOTHER DEFENDANT PLEAD GUILTY IN THIS FTX CRYPTOCURRENCY SCANDAL.

AND THIS IS THE GUY WHO HAD A PARTICULAR CONNECTION TO POLITICAL ACTION COMMITTEE THAT DONATED SO LAVISHLY TO -- LET'S SEE, CONGRESSWOMAN REBECCA BALINT.

NISHAD SINGH, HE WAS THE DIRECTOR OF ENGINEERING FOR THE FTX CRYPTO FIRM.

HE APOLOGIZED PROFUSELY FOR WHAT HE DID, SIX COUNTS INCLUDING FINANCE FRAUD.

THE NEWLY UNSEALED JUSTICE DEPARTMENT INDICTMENT IS OUT, AND WE ASKED CONGRESSWOMAN BALINT ABOUT THAT.

>> THERE ACTUALLY HAS BEEN NO INSINUATION THAT I HAVE DONE ANYTHING WRONG.

AND WE'RE FULLY COOPERATING BOTH WITH LAW ENFORCEMENT AND FOR ANY DOCUMENTS THAT THEY'VE ASKED FOR.

MY TEAM IS FULLY COMPLYING.

>> SO IS THERE MORE TO SAY ABOUT THIS, EMERSON?

>> YOU KNOW, THIS IS A STORY AS OLD AS TIME.

AS GEORGE WASHINGTON ONCE SAID, FEW POLITICIANS HAVE THE VIRTUE TO WITHSTAND THE HIGHEST BIDDER.

THAT'S KIND OF WHAT THIS IS ABOUT, TO AN EXTENT.

I DON'T THINK ANYBODY IS QUESTIONING WHETHER OR NOT BECCA BALINT KNEW WHAT WAS HAPPENING, SHE DIDN'T.

BUT THE QUESTION IS THE IMPACT ON THE ELECTORAL PROCESS AND OUR ELECTIONS, BECAUSE WE'VE NEVER HAD AN INDIVIDUAL DONATE $1 MILLION TO A PRIMARY CAMPAIGN IN THE LAST MONTH THAT'S HAD THIS KIND OF PROFOUND EFFECT.

AND A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE DOING IT, YOU KNOW, WITH A LOT OF REGRET, BECAUSE YOU'RE TALKING ABOUT A VERY HISTORICAL ELECTION THAT'S KIND OF BEEN SULLIED BUT THIS ENTIRE PROCESS.

AND THE QUESTION GOING FORWARD IS, HOW DO WE INSULATE OURSELVES FROM THIS?

BECAUSE YOU'RE LOOKING AT SOMETHING, AND THE QUESTION HERE IS THAT NOBODY KNEW WHERE THE $1 MILLION WAS COMING FROM, BECAUSE HE FILED AFTER JUNE 1 SO THAT YOU DON'T GET THE PUBLIC DISCLOSURE UNTIL AFTER THE PRIMARY.

BUT THE QUESTION IS, OKAY, EVEN AFTER ALL OF THAT, THE CAMPAIGN STILL ACCEPTED ANYWHERE FROM 25 TO $36,000 FROM THE SAME PEOPLE.

WHY?

AND WHAT HAPPENED?

WHAT DO WE DO?

WHAT DOES VERMONT DO TO PREVENT THEMSELVES FROM THIS TYPE OF EXPOSURE AGAIN?

>> IT SEEMS LIKE IT'S THAT LARGER QUESTION MORE SO THAN WAS THERE ANY MALFEASANCE NECESSARILY HAPPENING WITH THE BALINT CAMPAIGN, THAT'S MORE OF SORT OF WHERE I'VE SEEN IT.

THIS HAS HAPPENED AROUND THE COUNTRY TO A LOT OF DIFFERENT CAMPAIGNS.

IT'S CERTAINLY UNIQUE.

IN VERMONT WE HAVEN'T SEEN ANYTHING QUITE LIKE THIS HAPPEN.

AS THIS NEW INDICTMENT WAS UNSEALED AND MORE INFORMATION COMES OUT, SEEING HOW THE WEB OF THIS WORKS IS REALLY IMPORTANT FOR I THINK EVERYONE TO UNDERSTAND, LIKE THIS IS SOMEWHAT HOW POLITICS WORKS, AND WHETHER OR NOT THAT IS A GOOD THING IS SORT OF -- THAT'S KIND OF THE UNCOMFORTABLE QUESTION, IF THIS IS THE WAY THIS IS GOING TO WORK, ARE PEOPLE OKAY WITH THAT.

>> SARAH, I'M CURIOUS ON YOUR TAKE POLITICALLY, HOW IS THIS PLAYING OUT POLITICALLY?

WE'RE GOING TO BE SEEING THIS STORY, RIGHT, IN OCTOBER, THEY START -- THE TRIAL BEGINS.

IS THIS GOING TO BE HANGING AROUND FOR A WHILE?

>> OH, I MEAN, I THINK WE CONTINUE TO LEARN MORE AND MORE EVERY TIME WE GET SOMETHING FILED IN THE SOUTHERN DISTRICT OF NEW YORK.

I THINK WHAT REALLY STRIKES ME ABOUT THIS IS, IN THE INDICTMENT THAT WAS UNSEALED LAST WEEK, SOME OF THE COMMUNICATIONS BETWEEN FTX, YOU KNOW, PEOPLE IN THAT CIRCLE, EXECUTIVES AND A POLITICAL CONSULTANT, WE SAW THAT A POLITICAL CONSULTANT WHO IS UNNAMED TOLD MR. SINGH THAT HE WAS GOING TO HAVE TO DONATE MONEY TO WOKE CAUSES.

AND JUST THE TRANSACTIONAL AND CYNICAL NATURE OF THAT IS PRETTY STRIKING.

>> I AGREE WITH YOU, AND, YOU KNOW, YOU SIT BACK THERE, AND THEY'RE ASSUMING -- OR WE'RE ASSUMING A SENSE OF NAIVETE TOO, BECAUSE WHEN YOU COME OUT AND SEE THAT SOMEBODY HAS RECEIVED A MILLION BUCKS, ISN'T YOUR FIRST QUESTION, WHAT DO THEY WANT?

BECAUSE WHO WRITES YOU A CHECK FOR $1 MILLION AND JUST SAYS, OH, BY THE WAY, IT'S FOR PREVENTING FUTURE PANDEMICS.

IT'S LIKE, REALLY?

>> AND THAT'S WHAT WE'VE LEARNED IN THESE, YOU KNOW, DOCUMENTS THAT HAVE BEEN REVEALED BY THE SOUTHERN DISTRICT, IS THAT THAT WAS A FRONT.

>> TOTAL FRONT, JUST BUYING US, WHAT MONEY USUALLY DOES.

>> THAT'S WHY I GOT SO MANY FULL COLOR LARGE POSTCARDS URGING ME TO VOTE FOR BECCA BALINT THROUGHOUT 2022.

SPEAKING OF CONGRESS, THERE IS A BIPARTISAN EFFORT TO ADVANCE SOMETHING CALLED THE DAIRY PRIDE ACT, WHICH HAS THE LONGEST ACRONYM KNOWN TO WASHINGTON, AND THAT'S SAYING SOMETHING.

THIS ALL GETS TO THE HEART OF, WHAT IS MILK?

AND DO PLANT-BASED BEVERAGES QUALIFY?

LET'S LISTEN.

>> IT'S FRUSTRATING BECAUSE IT'S A LOT MORE WORK TO MAKE MILK THAN IT IS TO SQUISH UP SOME PLANTS, YOU KNOW?

YOU RAISE A COW FOR TWO YEARS OF CARING FOR HER AND FEEDING HER BEFORE SHE MAKES A DROP OF ANYTHING YOU CAN SELL.

>> IT'S REALLY IMPORTANT TO OUR FARMS THAT ARE STRUGGLING.

THEY'RE MAKING A GOOD PRODUCT.

LET'S MAKE CERTAIN THAT OTHER PRODUCTS THAT AREN'T MILK CAN'T USE THAT TERM.

>> WHAT IS LIKELY TO HAPPEN HERE?

THE FIGHT IS OVER FDA ALLOWING PLANT-BASED BEVERAGES TO USE THE WORD "MILK" ON THE LABEL.

WHO KNOWS WHAT'S GOING TO ACTUALLY -- IT'S ANYBODY'S GUESS.

IT'S AN AGE-OLD ARGUMENT.

THIS IS SOMETHING THAT INFURIATED DAIRY FARMERS FROM THE VERY OUTSET, FOR SOMEBODY TO BE ABLE TO GO TO THE GROCERY STORE AND LOOK AT CASHEWS AND ALMONDS AND OAT MILK OR OATS AS MILK.

IT'S NOT MILK.

OKAY.

NO, IT'S NOT.

BUT WE HAVE TO SHIFT IN THE COUPLE OF MINUTES WE HAVE LEFT TO TUESDAY'S TOWN MEEING DAY.

AND WE HAVE A GRAPHIC THAT WE'LL PUT ON THE SCREEN TO SHOW YOU JUST HOW DIFFERENT THIS ONE IS GOING TO BE.

THIS IS COURTESY OF THE VERMONT LEAGUE OF CITIES AND TOWNS.

AND, YOU KNOW, THERE'S A LOT UP FOR GRABS AND PROBABLY NOTHING BIGGER THAN JUST THE BOTTOM LINE, THAT 180 SOME-ODD COMMUNITIES ARE GOING TO HAVE IN-PERSON, FACE-TO-FACE FLOOR MEETINGS FOR THE FIRST TIME IN THREE YEARS, LIAM.

>> IT'S JUST LIKE THE OLD DAYS.

IT'S KIND OF WILD.

IT WILL BE NICE, I THINK, FOR A LOT OF FOLKS TO GO BACK.

TOWN MEETING DAY IS ABOUT THE FACE-TO-FACE, THE COMING TOGETHER OF THE COMMUNITY.

AND RETURNING TO THAT, A LOT OF PEOPLE ARE HAPPY FOR THAT.

>> GIVE US A COUPLE OF HIGHLIGHTS.

JUST CAUSE EVICTION IS UP FOR DEBATE IN A COUPLE OF COMMUNICATES.

>> YEP, IN ESSEX TOWN, BRATTLEBORO, TENANTS COULDN'T BE KICKED OUT OF APARTMENTS EXCEPT FOR SPECIFIC CAUSES.

BURLINGTON PASSED THAT BUT IT DIDN'T GET THROUGH THE CHARTER CHANGE PROCESS IN THE LEGISLATURE.

I'M CURIOUS TO SEE EXACTLY IF THESE PASS IN THOSE COMMUNITIES, WHETHER IT WILL MEET THE SAME FATE IN THE LEGISLATURE.

OBVIOUSLY SCHOOL BUDGETS, KEEPING AN EYE ON WHAT VOTERS SAY ABOUT SCHOOL BUDGETS.

WE'RE SEEING INCREASES ACROSS THE BOARD.

LABOR SHORTAGES AND INFLATION BEING THE BIG CAUSE THERE, OBVIOUSLY.

>> RUTLAND HAS A RACE FOR MAYOR.

THE THREE-TERM INCUMBENT, DAVID ALLAIRE, FACING A PRETTY STIFF CHALLENGE FROM THE PRESIDENT OF THE BOARD OF ALDERMEN, MIKE DOENGES.

MONTPELIER HAS A MAYORAL RACE.

BURLINGTON HAS A PRETTY CONTENTIOUS RACE INCLUDING FOR THE OVERSIGHT BOARD FOR THE POLICE DEPARTMENT.

AND THEY'RE BACK WITH INSTANT RUNOFF VOTING.

>> I'LL TRY TO BRIEFLY EXPLAIN -- >> YOU'LL HAVE TO BE QUICK.

>> -- THE POLICE BOARD.

IT WOULD BE A POWERFUL OVERSIGHT BOARD WITH THE ABILITY TO INVESTIGATE COPS ACCUSED OF ALLEGATIONS OF WRONGDOING, THEY CAN EVEN FIRE THE CHIEF.

THIS IS PRETTY CONTENTIOUS, -TH SIMILAR THAT THE PROGRESSIVES PASSED A COUPLE OF YEARS AGO.

WE'LL SEE WHAT VOTERS HAVE TO SAY.

THAT'S A CHARTER CHANGE.

IF IT PASSES, IT WILL MEET STIFF OPPOSITION IN MONTPELIER, I CAN'T IMAGINE THE GOVERNOR SIGNING IT, BUT WE'LL SEE WHAT HAPPENS.

>> NONCITIZEN VOTING AS WELL ON THE BALLOT IN BURLINGTON.

BEFORE WE RUN, ON A BEAUTIFUL FRIDAY, BEFORE THE SNOWSTORM MOVED IN, GOVERNOR SCOTT JOINING U.S.

SENATOR PETER WELCH UP IN ST. ALBANS, AT THE CONNOR MAPLE FARM, THE TREE TAPPING CEREMONY, IT DID START TO RUN IN JANUARY WHEN IT WAS CRAZY WARM.

THIS IS SURELY AN INDICATION THAT SPRING IS AROUND THE CORNER.

THAT'S WHERE WE'LL LEAVE THIS EDITION OF "VERMONT THIS WEEK."

MANY THANKS TO OUR PANEL, LIAM ELDER CONNORS FROM VERMONT PUBLIC, SARAH MEARHOFF FROM VTDIGGER, I'M STEWART LEDBETTER.

WE'LL SEE YOU BACK HERE NEXT FRIDAY NIGHT.